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Do you think kellz writing and producing skills have gotten better?

This is a discussion on Do you think kellz writing and producing skills have gotten better? within the R. Kelly Music Chat forums, part of the R. Kelly Discussion category; Hidden Content Originally Posted by V.I.P Hidden Content Rob does 'dumb down' his music sometimes, but 'Love Letter' is a ...

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    Hidden Content Originally Posted by V.I.P Hidden Content
    Rob does 'dumb down' his music sometimes, but 'Love Letter' is a great example of him showing control. He was being very serious with this album, no joking, no dumbing down. The problem is people only want R. Kelly to be 1 thing, when in fact he is 1 Million. Alot of the people who grew up with 12 Play, are still living on 12 Play, and probably always will. He is too diverse, and versatile for most people to keep up with - 'the gift, and the curse'. He can also write songs which if he sings them people dont 'feel' but are somehow a hit if somoene else sings them.

    So if you asked alot of people they would say they prefer the Old R. Kelly but Rob now is on another level to what he was - no doubt about it.
    would u say he dumb down his music between 93-2005?

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    Hidden Content Originally Posted by K. Johnson Hidden Content
    ^^u learn something new every day Lovely. Hidden Content

    seriously though, would you agree with me that Kells doesn't write songs just for the radio stations?
    In general Rob doesnt, but between 05-09 he was doing it alot more. For instance 'Ignition Remix' definitely wasnt written for the radios, but its arguably the song which the radio plays the most. You recognise its not a radio song, when he sings it live and he's got that Midwest slang thing going on his voice - I like that alot by the way. Hidden Content
    "You have reached R. Kelly, unfortunately Im asleep..." Hidden Content

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    Hidden Content Originally Posted by V.I.P Hidden Content
    In general Rob doesnt, but between 05-09 he was doing it alot more. For instance 'Ignition Remix' definitely wasnt written for the radios, but its arguably the song which the radio plays the most. You recognise its not a radio song, when he sings it live and he's got that Midwest slang thing going on his voice - I like that alot by the way. Hidden Content

    To play devil's advocate for a minute...lol i would argue that Ignition rmx was made in particular for radio...Here in Chicago, Ignition was a hot song but I believe he made the rmx to make the chocolate factory album pop...Imo, Rob knows what's radio friendly and what's not...Ex: Love Letter (song) and Number #1 hit are two radio friendly songs on the LL album...and look how well Love Letter (song) is being received....

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    Hidden Content Originally Posted by LovelyLP Hidden Content
    would u say he dumb down his music between 93-2005?
    I was writing my response to K. Johnson while you posted this. Hidden Content I would say no, he didnt really need to then, because pre 2004/5 RnB was still RnB, however since the transition to more of a Pop sound/composition on occasions he has had to.

    If you check it, Most of Rob's song work like this:

    - Intro
    - Verse
    - Chorus
    - Verse
    - Chorus
    - Bridge
    - Chorus
    - Outro

    He probably has more different words in his Intro, Outro and 1 of his verses than most normal songs have in their entirety - they are mostly the same thing repeated over and over. When he is just doing him, he will only repeat things on the Chorus, when he is dumbing his songwriting down he will probably have a Pre-Chorus, and there will be more repitition than normal.

    Just look at 'Number One Hit', the man is singing different words right up until the last second. Then look at 'Hairbraider' there is quite alot of repition. By the way I love 'Hairbraider' Hidden Content and this still has alot more words/complexity than the average song.

    Most people can only deal with a Chorus, and very simple words. Which is what really makes me laugh when people try to say Rob is a simple songwriter. That's not even close to true, but with those folk ignorance prevails. Hidden Content
    "You have reached R. Kelly, unfortunately Im asleep..." Hidden Content

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    Hidden Content Originally Posted by LovelyLP Hidden Content
    To play devil's advocate for a minute...lol i would argue that Ignition rmx was made in particular for radio...Here in Chicago, Ignition was a hot song but I believe he made the rmx to make the chocolate factory album pop...Imo, Rob knows what's radio friendly and what's not...Ex: Love Letter (song) and Number #1 hit are two radio friendly songs on the LL album...and look how well Love Letter (song) is being received....
    Again I was writing my response while you were writing yours. Hidden Content As for 'Ignition Remix', that's a potentially good point Hidden Content but remember this. Rob wrote the Remix at pretty much the same time as the original, which is a rarity. Then if you look at the songs start to finish 'Ignition' --> 'Ignition Remix' its like 1 very long song with the phrase "Usually, I dont do this" being the bridge. Both songs exist on their own, but as a combination/1 song they are another level.

    I really think that Rob was just in the zone when he wrote them, and it just happened that the Remix turned into such a hit. I mean he's even said, its not on the level of Thriller but he thinks 'Ignition Remix' is a song which will only come along once in a blue moon. The reason he said that was because Michael (Jackson) asked him to write a song just like the Remix, but he had to tell Mike sorry he couldnt.

    I (and Sister Ricky) and probably more people thought that he could, but this is what Rob said himself. Hidden Content

    As for 'Love Letter' and 'Number One Hit', they are radio friendly because they are so melodic. As Maxxx has said being able to have such an ear for melody as Rob has, is what sets him apart from almost everyone. If we agree that is the case, that means that when Rob is being Rob he always makes Radio friendly music - cuz his melodies are so great.
    Last edited by V.I.P; 03-21-2011 at 03:25 PM.
    "You have reached R. Kelly, unfortunately Im asleep..." Hidden Content

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    Hidden Content Originally Posted by V.I.P Hidden Content
    Again I was writing my response while you were writing yours. Hidden Content As for 'Ignition Remix', that's a potentially good point Hidden Content but remember this. Rob wrote the Remix at pretty much the same time as the original, which is a rarity. Then if you look at the songs start to finish 'Ignition' --> 'Ignition Remix' its like 1 very long song with the phrase "Usually, I dont do this" being the bridge. Both songs exist on their own, but as a combination/1 song they are another level.

    I really think that Rob was just in the zone when he wrote them, and it just happened that the Remix turned into such a hit. I mean he's even said, its not on the level of Thriller but he thinks 'Ignition Remix' is a song which will only come along once in a blue moon. The reason he said that was because Michael (Jackson) asked him to write a song just like the Remix, but he had to tell Mike sorry he couldnt.

    I (and Sister Ricky) and probably more people thought that he could, but this is what Rob said himself. Hidden Content

    As for 'Love Letter' and 'Number One Hit', they are radio friendly because they are so melodic. As Maxxx has said being able to have such an ear for melody as Rob has, is what sets him apart from almost everyone. If we agree that is the case, that means that when Rob is being Rob he always makes Radio friendly music - cuz his melodies are so great.
    Yes we finally agree! Lol do u think Rob has done his "thriller" album yet or would u say Chocolate Factory or TP2 were his "thriller" albums...

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    ^ Hidden Content Hmmm, they are close but Rob has got more in him - I am extremely confident about that. In fact I know it, we just pray that God keeps him safe so he can give it to the World.
    "You have reached R. Kelly, unfortunately Im asleep..." Hidden Content

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    Hidden Content Originally Posted by V.I.P Hidden Content
    Rob does 'dumb down' his music sometimes, but 'Love Letter' is a great example of him showing control. He was being very serious with this album, no joking, no dumbing down. The problem is people only want R. Kelly to be 1 thing, when in fact he is 1 Million. Alot of the people who grew up with 12 Play, are still living on 12 Play, and probably always will. He is too diverse, and versatile for most people to keep up with - 'the gift, and the curse'. He can also write songs which if he sings them people dont 'feel' but are somehow a hit if somoene else sings them.

    So if you asked alot of people they would say they prefer the Old R. Kelly but Rob now is on another level to what he was - no doubt about it.
    omg thanks for saying that. I hear ppl saying that stupid ish all the time "all R. Kelly sings about is sex" which couldnt be further from the truth. Love Letter was definitely him showing control & focus. he even said he sat back & did his hmwrk for LL. majority of tracks from TP3, Double Up & even Untitled to an extent were probably songs that were compiled from his vault that were already recorded. I had in my last post he dumbed down his music but decided to erase that one lol. but i'm glad i'm not the only one to think that too. yes its unfortunate ppl still looking at him as only Mr 12 Play or the old "R. Kelly"

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    my take and 2 cents

    with Donny Lyles as his right hand the Production has evolved even more and it has a wordly vibe.

    the Production is richer and fuller.

    the steppers Projects with strings and Orchestration,etc.. just add a whole new layer to his stuff.

    as a songwriter he is steady, and a Badd Brother, however Bump and Grind, back and forth, your body's callin, down low, I believe I can fly, you are not alone, Heaven's girl, when a woman's fed up, I wish,Step in the Name of Love, Ignitation,Happy People speak for themselves.


    now first name Charlie,Last name wilson, trapped in the closet 1-5 was tight, really good songwriting on love letter, though his voice, Production and arrangements and make no mistake about it this part I'm about to say is the truth about R.Kelly and Melody He has a COmmerical ear for what works and that is a Gift.

    it can be a curse if you feel he is pandering and trying to sound a certain way for radio, however he knows what works and he has that Ear and that is something that all the music theory, music playing lessons, etc.. simply can't teach you because that is a god given gift with your ears to hear.


    also R.Kelly can mimick and take anybody's song or vocal run and play it on the piano and do his spin on top of it.

    again that is a rare gift and his Mother taught him with Stevie Wonder's Master blaster jammin put a nickel on the needle and catch the runs of Stevie Wonder and he did that on the making of the "So Sexy" video with twista.

    i think his music is fuller and he is going in more directions than ever, i can't say he is writing better than before because

    as you know and One of my all time favorite lyrics are a decade old with the line "elevators going sideways" to me a song like "Some things never change" contains the kind of songwriting where if he put that out, then he would rise higher as a Lyricist IMO.

    as a All around Artist He is way up there all time for me, as a Producer way up there because he can work with anyone.

    songwriting now depends on the talent, chemistry and the songs.

    the 90's is going to win because he worked with Michael Jackson, Luther Vandross, Quincy Jones, TOni Braxton, Isley Brothers, maxwell,Aaliyah, etc.. I mean he wrote huge songs for others back then

    in the 00's His own stuff on his own was 2 times better IMO than what he gave others though I dug him and charlie Wilson, Isleys, Michael Jackson,.

    Love Letter was a vast improvement for his writing and he got back to his thing.

    i do feel after Happy People/U Saved Me that he did Pander a bit because aside from trapped in the closet, kickin it with your girlfriend,wind for me, and a few tracks on doubple up and untitled combined, he seemed desperate not to be that young, but slightly older dude at the club.

    glad he stepped his game up.

    now his Colabs game with Snoop, Jeezy, Twista, some with Jay Z,Ja Rule,do or die, fat joe, on the bigger tracks of the 00's IMO were more interesting on a whole than 05-09 IMO.

    this is a great question and I the Musical VIrus Project alone says to me as did Loveland and now Love letter and especially Chocolate facotory and Happy People that he has so much more left to offer, however industry politics and his own duel idenity with playing both sides to stay cool means some things are tight and some things are just ok.

    bottom line i expect the day when he does all instrumental albums.

    i see the smooth jazz, african, island based music in full effect, I expect that Sam Cooke gut bucket thang that is bound to drop.

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    I would love to hear an original instrumental album or even an accoustic sound like on the raw video w/Leon Timbo that he killed freestyle. that was a great melody. imagine a neosoul album from Kelly!

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